One idea: Creating a loaner program for mobility scooters and powered wheelchairs
By Gwendolyn Craig
The state proposed a few temporary and partial solutions for carrying people with mobility disabilities to Great Camp Santanoni in Newcomb, but it’s unclear when they may begin rolling.
A horse and wagon operation has generally started in May for transporting people the 5 miles back on a dirt road to the Great Camp buildings. After a delayed start in a contract for 2024, longtime wagon operator Larry Newcombe and Great Camp Santanoni announced May 15 that Newcombe is now taking ride reservations.
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A meeting on the accessibility issue held May 8 in Warrensburg has others hopeful about alternatives to the wagon, which is not ADA-compliant.
Adirondack Park Agency and state Department of Environmental Conservation staff met with members of the APA and DEC’s accessibility advisory committee. They discussed “any viable options that provide meaningful access” to the Great Camp, according to the agenda. The meeting was closed to the public and included remarks from Interim DEC Commissioner Sean Mahar, who participated virtually.
The DEC responded to the Explorer’s inquiries after this story appeared online May 10, saying it offered options on access and looks forward to feedback. The department plans to offer “a pilot program for two wheelchair devices this summer” plus a case-by-case accommodation program.
Kathryn Carroll, vice-chair of the committee, said there will be “some access this summer, but not necessarily the full solution.”
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The DEC is looking at a free pilot loaner program for its state-owned powered mobility scooter, a powered adult wheelchair and a powered child-sized wheelchair that could be used to make the 5-mile trip down the gravel road, Carroll said. The scooter and the wheelchairs are described by manufacturers as heavy duty and four-wheeled.
The program is under development, and it’s not immediately clear when it could begin. An agenda for the meeting lists it as a “pilot loaner program.”
The DEC is also considering a case-by-case permit process for people with mobility disabilities to use equipment called “other power-driven mobility devices,” or OPDMDs. An OPDMD, according to the Americans with Disabilities Act, is “any mobility device powered by batteries, fuel, or other engines … used by individuals with mobility disabilities for the purpose of locomotion.” A golf cart is an example.
Finally, the DEC is considering granting a permit to a horse-drawn wagon operator to continue providing that service at the Great Camp.
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All of these options, Carroll said, may be solutions for some people with mobility disabilities, but still leave others out.
Longer term solutions, Carroll and other members of the advisory committee said, could involve reclassifying or clarifying the use of the road.
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Forever Wild meets ADA
The Great Camp is the only publicly owned former retreat of its kind in the 6-million-acre Adirondack Park. Due to rules governing the park’s forest preserve, the five-mile trail to get to the historic site cannot be accessed by public motorized vehicles. The road is classified as “administrative,” meaning only state employees can drive down it for state-authorized purposes. The scooter and e-wheelchair could be seen as falling outside the kinds of vehicles that are prohibited.
An Americans with Disabilities Act settlement in 2001 requires the state to provide access to the forest preserve for people with disabilities. To address the settlement, the state has contracted with a horse and wagon operator to bring people to the historic site.
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Normally Larry Newcombe would be hitching his horses to his wagon around now, to make the trek to the Great Camp. Newcombe had been providing that service for many years, however the DEC informed him that his wagon does not meet ADA specifications.
The DEC, with input from the accessibility advisory committee, built a 3,500-pound cart to accommodate “13 people in forward-facing seats, five wheelchairs or a combination thereof,” according to its specifications. It spent $37,320 on it.
Though the DEC says it consulted Newcombe on the design, Newcombe says the department didn’t. He refused to pull the wagon, stating it was too heavy for his horses, too big for the road and dangerous for everyone.
“When they were designing it, it was an incredibly thoughtful process,” Carroll said. “My experience was very positive, but all I can say about his ability to work with it is just an incredible shame and letdown.”
In January, the state released requests for information, hoping to hear from different horse-and-wagon operators, who could pull the accessible cart. In March, it terminated Newcombe’s contract.
Scott Remington, a member of Carroll’s committee, who has been fighting for access to the Great Camp for about 10 years now, said he thinks Newcombe was “put out to dry by the state. Really, the state is the one ultimately that should be keeping track of this,” he said. “It’s their responsibility.”
A ‘deeply personal’ issue
Erin Tobin, executive director of Adirondack Architectural Heritage, said she has had to adjust her organization’s programming due to the uncertainty of access options.
Despite managing the Great Camp in partnership with the DEC and the town of Newcomb, Tobin said she was not invited to the Wednesday meeting. She had not heard of a timeline for the short-term accessibility measures from the state.
Some members of the accessibility advisory committee want to see motorized access to the site. Remington was especially frustrated by how DEC staff can drive to the Great Camp for various projects, but those with disabilities cannot. Remington, a Brant Lake resident who uses a wheelchair, would like to visit the site via a golf cart.
Meg LeFevre Bobbin, a former resident of Plattsburgh who now lives in Albany, became paralyzed in a skiing accident at Titus Mountain in 2001. She joined the accessibility advisory committee about six months ago.
“This subject is deeply personal, and it’s really hard to convey to people who don’t have a disability just how different we experience the world,” she said. “I just know that fighting about something or having an us versus them mentality is probably not the answer. I felt really hopeful that DEC is authentic in what they were saying.”
Bobbin also felt Remington’s frustration, and others, about how long the access issue has been discussed.
“I hope they’ll have something in place this year,” Remington said. “At least they are listening. Whether they’ll do the right thing, that’s yet to be seen.”
Top photo: Santanoni Great Camp Newcomb lake Historic Preservation farm ADKs, Courtesy of NYSDEC
Clarification: This story has been updated to clarify the state’s wheelchairs will be part of a free pilot loaner program and not a fee-based rental program.
Editor’s note: This story was updated May 16 with new information about wagon operations in 2024.
Adirondack policy, explained
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Seems to me – at least short-term – DEC should permit Newcombe for another year to continue with the old wagon. In the meantime, consider changing the SLMP to allow an exception (or localized classification change) for the access road and camp – specifically allowing electronic motors/devices for the DISABLED (perhaps with a DEC permit sticker) while making the Camp “grounds” more ADA compliant. I don’t see an issue with taxpayers carving out a small area of the Park for mobility-impaired people. People don’t visit a Great Camp for a true Wilderness experience.
Why punish the disabled public for a dust-up between the DEC and a contractor? The contractor certainly needs to consider his horses and safe operation as his primary consideration. Whether or not he approved of the bigger wagon, safety is still his responsibility and he should get the final say. Why seek out a new, unproven contractor that agrees to haul the bigger wagon? Repurpose or sell the wagon if it is too big.
Unfortunately, we all know there is a certain bunch of folks that will go ballistic the first time one of the state’s electric buggies makes a trip to the camp. I fear this will get uglier before a practical solution comes along. I feel bad for Necombe who has provided his services for years and is now being portrayed as a bad guy.
I agree. All of those years there have been few public complaints about the relationship between DEC and Newcombe. I tend to side with the person that has been providing a unique service for a long time to know what he and his horses can safely and practically pull and maneuver. Someone here isn’t telling the full truth. Perhaps an independent probe?
Please allow battery-powered four wheel mobility scooters (and maybe a charging station) even if there is a small fee for a permit. Why should I, and other disabled individuals be discriminated against because our legs don’t work anymore? Our eyes can still appreciate the beauty, our nose can breathe in the smells of the forest, and our ears can hear the wind making music in the trees!
If the greater good for now is to allow the old wagon to continue with a waiver signed…that’s probably best.
Yes, I can see how it would have been useful to contact ANYONE who knows about horses pulling vehicles about pulling that wagon.
And I agree that battery-powered scooters + a sustainable charging station makes sense, with free rentals available. Though make sure to take into account people accompanying a person in a motorized wheelchair, they may not want to walk as far as a motorized chair can go!!!
I’ve used Larry Newcombs horse n wagon for many trips in to the Great Camp!! He’s a great person & really cares about his horses. DEC’s new proposed wagon is way too heavy for his horses to pull ! Along with wheel chairs ….common sense kicks in…No way is it feasible.
I’ve done this trip atleast 12 different times w/ Larry. Larry is correct it’s too dangerous for his horses because of the ridiculous wagon weight & wheelchairs. I’ve biked this, hiked this & rode in Larry’s horse n’ wagon.
Please folks, work together….let Larry have his horse n wagon – renew his permit! Common sense….That ridiculous heavy wagon would NEVER be safe for the horses. Lets not forget about that! DEC back to the drawing boards….people be part of the solution…..
Data in the previous article about this situation indicated that only 5 mobility impaired people in the last 10 years have presented themselves for rides to the camp, and the current operation has easily handled this. If you need to something more, just put one or two of these state owned rigs at the start, and let the once-every-two years customer use it. So this year’s pilot is the right idea; it seems someone finally slapped some sense into the idiots in Albany, after the previous debacle revealed that the state is stupid. Experience has shown many boots-on-the-ground people that the only way to get Albany to fix something is to reveal their stupidity in the press.
Of course, the “committee” will continue working to screw this up. No doubt in another few years, someone will once again have to reveal Albany’s stupidity in the press to fix whatever the “committee” dreams up.
This article has become awfully convoluted with the “updates”. Title says wagon rides are to resume, Newcombe is to take reservations, but I couldn’t figure out what conveyance he will be using. But I may have missed something – I am not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
I would also be interested in what the new STATE wagon would weigh fully loaded with passengers and gear. Does it have brakes suitable for hilly terrain? I can understand Newcombe’s trepidation. Maybe the first trip in should be a wagon-load of NYS officials to see how well it works.
Are all areas of the road wide enough to accommodate the wagon and proposed personal mobility devices side-by-side? Some people who use these devices full-time are not always capable of maintaing a straight line course – especially if they are stressed or in a confined area – like when a horse-drawn wagon is approaching or overtaking. And hopefully some type of communication device would be used in case of emergency, tipping, or breakdown. I assume all of this has been accounted for in the plan.
Perhaps a new article addressing some of these issues could be written soon to avoid further confusion.